Clear Trauma Now

Trauma doesn’t just live in memories. It hides in the body, locks into identity, and quietly runs decisions until we feel like we’re fighting ourselves.

I’m Dr. Daniel Roberts, and I sit down with Dr. Judith A. Swack, PhD, a biochemist and immunologist who became a pioneer in energy psychology and mind-body healing. Judith created Healing From the Body Level Up (HBLU), a practical model that treats us as multi-level beings: conscious mind, unconscious mind, body, and soul. When those levels fall out of alignment, “knowing better” doesn’t fix the problem, because talk and logic don’t automatically clear fear, shame, or stress patterns stored deeper down.

We dig into two hands-on tools that listeners can actually use: muscle testing to get a reliable readout from the body, and tapping (EFT) to calm trauma activation fast, including those middle-of-the-night adrenaline spikes. Then we turn to the heart of moral injury in veterans: the painful beliefs that get woven into identity after combat, including the crushing internal verdict “I am a murderer.” Judith shares how amend-making forgiveness, drawn from the Jewish practice of teshuvah, can help repair internal betrayal and reduce guilt when the inner levels finally become congruent.

We also talk about trauma from sexual assault, the importance of asking respectful inner questions, and why reproducible, step-by-step protocols matter for skeptics who want something grounded and repeatable. If you want to go deeper, Judith’s book is Clear Trauma Now, and her resources including mass trauma healing webinars and a free consult are at hblu.org.

Subscribe for more conversations on moral injury and trauma recovery, share this with someone who needs relief, and leave a review with your biggest takeaway.

Learn more at HBLU.org

Transcript

Welcome And Guest Introduction

SPEAKER_01 0:34

Hi, everybody. Welcome to the Moral Injury Support Network Podcast. I'm Dr. Daniel Roberts, President and CEO of Moral Injury Support Network for Service Women Incorporated, a 501c3 nonprofit based in North Carolina that works with women veterans who are suffering from trauma that they experience while serving in the military. Today we have a great guest with us, Dr. Judith Swack, PhD, a biochemist and immunologist, master NLP practitioner, mind-body healer, best-selling author and leader in the field of energy psychology. Dr. Swack is the originator of healing from the body level up, HBLU, an innovative and powerful methodology with transformative results. HBLU integrates biomedical science, psychology, hypnosis, NLP, applied kinesiology, energy psychology, and spiritual techniques with original research on the structure of complex damage patterns. Her latest book is Clear Trauma Now, a powerful solution for getting unstuck. Dr. Swack works with clients in person and by Zoom. Welcome to the show, Dr. Swack. I'm so eager to talk to you today.

SPEAKER_02 1:54

This is very important work. Very important work.

SPEAKER_01 1:58

Yeah, I, you know, I told you before we started the show that uh your book has been really transformative for me. And it came at a time when it was really needed. But I'd love to get before we get into the specifics of uh the different protocols and stuff, I'd love to get a little background about you, sort of how you got into this work, what your uh clinical experience is and stuff.

SPEAKER_02 2:26

Well, I was in my 30s and I was getting my PhD in biochemistry at the National Cancer Institute in Bethesda as an external student at George Washington University. And my career was obviously going very well, but I wanted to date and have a love life, you know, 30s woman. And I kept attracting the same emotionally unavailable man in different bodies over and over again, and and get I got hurt over and over again.

From Lab Scientist To Healer

SPEAKER_02 3:00

Now, at that time, I believed, and remember, I was young and a scientist, I believed that the purpose of the body was to carry around your head.

SPEAKER_01 3:10

I can relate.

SPEAKER_02 3:11

Okay. So I pointed to my head and I said to myself, which I thought was my head, which isn't myself, but I thought it was. I said, I'm a smart woman. Why can't I figure out what I'm doing wrong? Why can't I fix this? And I'm pointing to my head. Now, fortunately, one of the men that I was dating recommended that I take a self-help workshop called Actualizations. And actualizations introduced me to the unconscious mind, which of course I didn't know was there because I was unconscious of it. But I'm a scientist and I got very excited about this new discovery. Woo! An unconscious mind. What's that? And I realized it was running 90% of my life. I knew nothing about it. So I trained in neurolinguistic programming, just like you. And neurolinguistic programming is the science of how the unconscious mind works, and it gives you specific tools to release and repattern the parts of your unconscious mind that aren't working for you. So I trained in NLP, and it was a two-semester course. And in the second semester, two of my classmates caught me at a break and said, Judith, we would like to work with you privately. And I said, What are you talking about? I'm a scientist. I work in a laboratory, I wear a lab coat. You know, I don't even have an office. I couldn't even imagine wearing street clothes and sitting in an office across from somebody in a chair, right? And this woman says, Well, you can use my office in the evenings. It's five minutes from your house, and I'm a social worker. It's a social worker office. And I said, Okay. And I said, But um, you know what? I don't really know what I'm doing. Go ask the trainers of this course to work with you. They know what they're doing. And I said, Go away. And I literally signaled Shu with my hand, Shu, go away. So they crossed their arms and stared at me and said, No. And then she said, Furthermore, my husband wants to work with you. He shares the office suite and he wants to work with you. And this man says, I am a real estate agent and I'm divorced, and my son is living with you. Not only do I want to work with you, but my son wants to work with you. So basically I said, No, go away. And suddenly I had an office and four clients staring at me. So I um thought, well, I'm really good at this. I love it because, of course, it was so interesting and intriguing and new and fascinating. And I was really good at it. So I thought, well, I'll I'm willing to do the experiment. So I said, All right, uh, I'll try it and see what happens. And of course, I was very good at it, and uh I helped them a lot, and they sent me more people, and so I had this ongoing practice in an office five minutes from my house in the evenings. So by day I was a bench scientist, and by night I was a mind-body healer, right?

SPEAKER_01 6:21

Yeah, it's awesome.

SPEAKER_02 6:23

And uh, and and the rest continued because I learned more stuff and I added to it, and so on and so forth. And one of my clients, uh, after I finished my uh PhD in Washington, I moved to uh Boston, got a postdoctoral fellowship at the Dana Farber Cancer Institute in human immunology, but I continued my practice here in Boston, and one of my clients here said, you know, I know a woman who gets me through my stuff faster than you do. I of course said, Aha, it's a challenge. And fortunately, that woman was doing a training the next week in Boston, which I signed up for immediately. And that's where I learned that you have a soul. Who knew? Right. I thought I had it all nailed down when I understood the unconscious mind, but no, there's a soul and a body, soul and body levels. Um I was like, oh wow, more. So I launched into that. I learned muscle testing, which I'll talk about. Right. And I, as I explored all these inner levels, I realized that uh I needed to have a sort of a coherent model of reality and philosophy. So I came up with healing from the body level up, and this is how it's organized. I assume, again, these are presuppositions in my model of reality. I assume that we have a soul and it's in a body. With me so far?

SPEAKER_01 7:52

Yeah, not a not a major, not a not a too difficult of a leap.

SPEAKER_02 7:56

Okay, just saying, and um, and we also have an unconscious mind and a conscious mind. Now, your conscious mind is the mind that is that you're aware of when

The HBLU Model Of Inner Levels

SPEAKER_02 8:10

you're awake. So that's the mind that's logical and rational and very literal. You know, it sees what's happening in the environment right now, it's very literal. So that's your conscious mind. Now, because that's the only mind that you're aware of consciously, people tend to think that's their identity and that's all there is. And I, of course, found out no, there isn't all there is, there's a lot more. So when people come in, I train their conscious minds to connect with their internal levels. I teach them about that. So the unconscious mind is the land of imagination, emotion, memory, creativity, and habit. Right. So I teach them that's that, and emotion runs behavior. So and the more strongly you feel about something, the more it runs your behavior. Right. And if you have beliefs, I call them limiting beliefs, that you believe, you feel are true, even if your conscious mind knows it isn't true, you st your your feelings are going to run your behavior and make and your decisions.

SPEAKER_01 9:20

So I can I can attest to all this because uh I'm 54 years old now, and I've spent I grew up in church, spent most of my life, you know, as a Christian studying the Bible and so on. I had a brief when I first went the army, a brief break from that, and I've had occasional breaks from that also because um there were there were things that all my study and church going and all that wasn't getting to, right? And then I can also talk about how you know people have said you live in your head, Dan, which means you're very, very rational, but people didn't know me well, like you have a hard time getting to the emotional things other than anger, right? And that kind of stuff. So, so long story short, like I've worked on all these parts of me: the soul, the conscious mind, and consciously trying to talk myself out of emotions and behaviors that I knew weren't serving me, because I've read almost everything there is to read. I'm sort of exaggerating there, but I've read all kinds of spiritual books, all kinds of religious books, all kinds of mental books, all kinds of and so business. I mean, I'm an avid reader, I'm very introspective because I think leaders are that. I think leaders are readers, they're introspective, they're learners, they're growing. I'm totally bought into that. Not just because I need it, but I love learning. But until I got your book, honestly, um, I was never integrated. What I call now my my main purpose each day is to integrate myself, but but you you you like captured those in a all those different elements in a way that I instantly um instantly said, Oh, this is a problem. I was fragmented. I was I would either focus on spiritual but still feel like crap, honestly, or I would focus on the rational mind, but still, but my but my soul was sort of starving, and I was always like trying to find the thing that would fix all this, and turns out like no, that's not how it works. You have to fully integrate all your pieces, right? What's great about your system is you have a simple way for people to fully integrate and connect with all their different pieces, um, which I think what this life is generally about, because you also include personal mission in that, right? So it's not just about being happy all the time, but you have a mission and a purpose here, right?

SPEAKER_02 12:13

So, yeah, I'm I call that aligning the levels. So I believe that the soul is in the body to experience this form of life in this form of body, and why? Because I believe every soul has a purpose, meaning we're here to make a contribution to the three-dimensional world so that it's better off for our having been here, and that's what gives our life meaning. But we're also here to experience physical life. So you want to love, you want to dance, you want to eat, you want to reproduce, your bodies want to reproduce, you want to have children, you want to make connections, you you want to experience, you know, you want to make money, you want to be comfortable, you want to travel, you want to have the best life possible in this form. So you got to learn the rules of the game and you got to play it to the max, and you know, get skills and resources and training and and healing, whatever you need to really optimize this opportunity. This lifetime is an opportunity. And um, so and then ultimately, in the grand scheme of things, the purpose of your soul being here and making contribution and having this experience is for your soul to grow and evolve. Yeah, absolutely. So ultimately, it's about growing and evolving. And people ask me, what do I mean by soul? And I say a soul is a packet, a unit of God energy. What do I mean by God? God is an energetic force in of life, the life force energy of the universe, and you know, everything that's alive has got energy in it, and so I believe that God, I picture it because of course I'm a biologist, as an amoeba, a gigantic fluorescent green amoeba in this guy, right? Yeah, and we are all pseudopod extensions of source energy. Uh, and so our unit of of God energy is in packaged in this body, and but we're connected to the overall source. So as we grow and evolve, everything that we experience, our choices, how we create our lives, that information gets piped back up to the central brain, basically. And we can also pull on the central brain or the central resource energy unit, God. We can pull on that to manifest. We can pull on the larger library, basically, of resources to bring it down into our unit to expand it out into our life path to create and manifest the kind of life we want. So I think that's ultimately why we're here is to grow and evolve our souls and to play the game and have the best experience possible in this form and make and you know, make a contribution. So that's the challenge. That's a game, yes.

SPEAKER_01 15:20

Yeah, I I I completely agree with that. And when you really think about it, like um every major religion has some version of that kind of concept, right? Christians talk about basically the Holy Spirit, you could say in Judaic, because I worked for several rabbis when I was in the army, and uh I've read lots and lots and lots of rabbinic literature, and so um rabbinic literature, Judaism has a similar, very similar concepts. So we often hear so for people that are very religious, they hear that and they go, Oh, that's new age. That's uh no, we all have that concept, and you you're you didn't provide it in a religious language, but it's all there. Um, and if you think about Buddhism and on all these others, there's so to me, like that's a huge key that all these different do using different words, but the same basic concept of hey, we are an extension of God, and the purpose um is that we have a purpose here, and it's growth and ultimately growth and development to be able to experience uh heaven or the afterlife, whatever we want to call it, in a full and complete way, and and this life is part of that growth. You don't just die and instantly, hey, you're ready for heaven. That's not how it works, that's not how our you know. So, anyway, I I love that that that really if somebody say very religious and this sounds weird for them, just think if you really look in in your scriptures and think, hey, there's this connection to the Holy Spirit, and what you do is provide one way, one method that people can can sort of like access that um that's very similar to prayer, right?

SPEAKER_02 17:19

Yeah, um, so I teach people's conscious minds how to can how to talk to their souls.

SPEAKER_01 17:30

And that's not an easy thing to do. I mean, a lot of people struggle with that. Yeah, a lot of people do.

SPEAKER_02 17:37

Yeah, it you I use muscle testing because I don't know a better way to do it, because your conscious mind can barely connect with your unconscious mind, you know. And certainly your conscious mind doesn't know how to connect with your body, nor does it know how to connect with your soul. So I train people to use muscle testing. Now, muscle testing is like lie detector testing. You go to a police station and they hook you up to a

Muscle Testing As Inner Readout

SPEAKER_02 18:04

machine with sensors that will register your autonomic body signals for stress. And why do they do that? Because they don't believe that your face is going to tell them the truth, right? They assume you're gonna lie to them, so they're gonna check what your body says because the body will register true and false. So they connect you to a machine and they ask you true and false questions and they watch the readout on a monitor, right?

SPEAKER_01 18:30

It's a great, great analogy. I mean, that makes totally make sense.

SPEAKER_02 18:37

So I we don't need to use a machine, a fancy machine. You can do a readout of the body signals using something called muscle testing. So, muscle testing, uh, for those of you who've been to a nutritionist or a chiropractor or something, they ask you to hold your arm out to the side and they press on it, and then they ask you to say a true statement, they press on it, it holds. They ask you to say a false statement, and they press on it, your arm goes weak. Um, I do it similar. I just have people hold their arms out in front of them, just float it, and I press yes and it holds, and no, it goes down. And then I say, we're gonna send questions into your inner levels and let the body be the readout. So the body is the machine, basically. So with once we establish the signals and the readout, um, then we can ask questions of your inner levels. And really the trick is to know what to ask and to know where to look for it. So remember, before I knew I had an unconscious mind, I was just swimming around in my conscious mind, lost, because that wasn't where the answer was. And then I found it was in the unconscious mind. So you have to know where to look and you have to have the right questions to ask. But that's what I spent four decades doing is figuring out where to look and coming up with the questions to ask. So I assume that if somebody isn't getting the results they want in their life, I assume that there's some kind of interference or block at one of the inner levels, at least one of the inner levels. So you have to go looking for it. If you can't figure it out mentally, then it's inside. So I muscle test people through my list of patterns that cause interference at different levels, and then I have a menu of 52 techniques, 52 techniques that work at different levels. And in minutes, once I find the block, we use the right technique, we muscle test that and release it. So it turns out that the conscious mind, if it doesn't have tools and it doesn't understand techniques, it does the best it can by trying to talk you out of it or shout you out of it or criticize you out of it.

SPEAKER_01 20:54

Yep, yep, yep.

SPEAKER_02 20:55

But talking is a conscious mind exercise. Talking does not change how you feel, it doesn't release anything at the unconscious level, it certainly doesn't release anything at the body level, and it certainly doesn't release anything at the soul level. So when people criticize themselves, I say, Well, did that work for you? Because I don't think that's the technique of choice to clear this block. And so I'm gonna give you tools, oh conscious mind, so you don't feel frustrated. So the first thing I teach people is tapping. Now, tapping, also known as meridian tapping, and you might have heard of it called EFT or emotional freedom technique. Um, I I renamed it natural biodestressing because I think it's biological. I don't think it's woo-woo or strange at all. I think it's chemistry basically. Yeah, of course, for me, everything is chemistry pretty much, but anyway, I teach people tapping, and then I say, all right, if you are having a negative feeling about something that A isn't true and you know it consciously, and B, it's running your behavior

Tapping To Calm Trauma Fast

SPEAKER_02 22:04

and you're struggling with it, just locate where the feeling is in your body and then use tapping to release it, and it'll release in just a few minutes, and then it never comes back and it never bothers you. So the first thing your conscious mind needs to notice is what isn't working, what doesn't make sense logically. And then instead of yelling at yourself, you need to go looking for what's causing the block. So I teach people muscle testing, and I teach them self muscle testing so that. Can test themselves at home and any given day and even in the middle of the night. You know, you talked about waking up in the middle of the night, not being able to go back to sleep, and then using tapping, and you went back to sleep. I did that. I used to wake up at three o'clock in the morning because I run a business, and of course, that's anxiety provoking. I'd wake up in the middle of the night, um, uh upset about something in my business, and I would sneak off to the bathroom so I didn't wake up my husband. Oh, by the way, I did get happily married, it worked, yay. Um I would tap so I didn't wake him up, and then I go back to sleep. So, you know, your conscious mind's job is to notice what isn't working and then bring resources and tools to heal it. That's its job. Its job is not to criticize you or suppress or rationalize or make excuses or what. But that's a behavior that conscious minds do when they don't have tools. Right. And if you know, and if you don't have the tools, that's the best you can do, is basically try to talk yourself out of it and breathe through it. Right. Although yelling at yourself doesn't really help. I'm just gonna say, don't bother.

SPEAKER_01 23:43

Yeah, no, I I I agree. And it's funny because I I start doing the same thing, our little the master bathroom right next to the bedroom. I would just and I haven't had to do it for a while, you know. It it's made such a difference that even if I wake up in the night, I'm usually able to go back to sleep right away without even getting up many times. But that particular night when I first learned how to do it, I said, What I had done nights before is I would spend all night walking the floors and I would leave the bedroom and I would walk in the living room and I would pray and I would do this and I would do that, and it would keep Patty up. She would, because she'd be worried about me, and or she'd hear this movement in the in the house, and she'd be worried about an invader or whatever, you know, just what your mind so she's not sleeping either, and and all this. So, what I did then was just sneak in the bathroom, tap for a couple minutes, find that all that adrenaline started like eking away really fast. I started to feel like, oh, and then uh when I was able to do, and I would love for you uh to talk about this real briefly. You kind of touched on it, but this this um you know, asking yourself questions, find out what's going on. The first night I started doing this, all kinds of things came up in just a in just a quick minute, right? And and I knew instantly they were true, they rang instantly true. Um, and I was able to that first night get back in bed. Um, I didn't immediately go to sleep, but because I was these things had come up, and I was beginning to make commitments to myself about fixing them, right? I would be uh like I had a thing with my arm that came up, and I said, you know what? From now on, I'm gonna start working on that. And my arm was able to say, okay, and calm down, right? Like physiologically, my body was calming down as I was making promises to it about I'm gonna start taking care of that now. I'm gonna start, and so I'd love for you to just briefly talk about how you get before the muscle testing when you're doing this, asking yourself this question about you know, sort of accessing that higher wisdom and finding out, okay, what's going on here? What is what is what am I feeling? Uh, can you briefly talk about that?

SPEAKER_02 26:19

Yeah, I teach people to do exactly what you did. I say to your conscious mind, notice that something isn't working, notice that something is going on. And then I say, tune in, you know, tune in inside, go inside and and scan inside and ask what's going on inside, who's talking to me? What are you trying to show me? And and and the feelings will come up. These parts of you want to be healed, they want to communicate. So when you ask, they all pop up. And um, and then you talk to them and you say, Okay, I didn't realize there was a problem here. And I I hear what you're saying, and I'm gonna write it down and I'm gonna treat it. You know, I'll I'll put you on my list to treat, not necessarily right now because I'm sleeping, but I'll get to you tomorrow or I'll get to you the next day. Right. And and then you promise that you're gonna treat these parts. So yeah, things pop up. Pay attention, and um, I say be respectful. Be respectful. You may not like how these parts are feeling, you may not like what they're telling you, but they need healing. So everything is a communication, is what I say. Every everything is a communication, all everything you experience, everything you think, everything you feel, everything you do is a communication and basically gets honored. And if it needs to be treated, you treat it. There you go. Everything, everything gets treated.

SPEAKER_01 27:48

Yeah, I I love also what you talked about in the book is like don't wait. When you're when when you're when you're feeling like when that feeling of like something's wrong, don't don't just put it off. I'll get to that later. Like immediately, if you if you're having a trauma experience, for instance, immediately start tapping that, start or you know, exactly. Find out what's going on, start tapping, start working with it. Um, don't don't let it fester. And and I kind of did that yesterday. I had a thing that happened. I kind of instead of deal, I kept saying I'll deal with it, and it just kept building up instead of just saying, Hey, this is let me, you know, I'm having an emotional, I'm being triggered right now. Let me go find a quiet room and and just work on this, get this, you know, calmed. And and I didn't do that, you know, and so so I love that you talk about get on it right away. Don't, you know, because the action steps later, like what you may have to do to completely solve the problem, might might come later or might take more time, but at least the trauma response, get that calmed down right away, right?

SPEAKER_02 29:06

And then you can think, right, because you can't think or make good decisions when you're emotionally triggered.

SPEAKER_01 29:15

Right. Yeah, and we I just I think there's um fortunately for me, and I and I'll and I'll be honest with you, I've had lots of people, I have some really good friends that are into a lot of energy stuff. Um, and they've tried it, they've encouraged me to before to get in it, and I would like try it a little bit, and but I was still really committed to my rational mind being the answer, right? And then finally, what happened to me is I just crashed so hard that there was I was desperate for anything to work, and that's that I'm forever thankful for that. I'm so grateful to God that that he allowed me to crash. Finally, God said, That's enough, right? You've you've been doing this long enough, right? It you've done you've tried your part, you've tried your way, and let's let's and so that was the greatest experience of my life, you know, and because now I began using these techniques, I have a totally different philosophy about life, and even when I study the scriptures, I see them in a very new, completely new way. Like I'm getting insights into my life out of the blue that ring true. I'm not even working hard, it's just like it's like now that I'm opened myself up completely to my whole person, yes, it's talking to me all the time, and I'm having these amazing experiences every day. I can look forward to go, I'm gonna learn something awesome today. I don't know what it is, but I'm gonna learn great stuff, and I can look back at the end of the day and tick off like a dozen things that happened that day that make me feel good. Perfect, you know, and it's just and and your system doesn't require like a PhD, it's some simple things that are based on the assumption, like you said, that your body knows, that your person knows.

SPEAKER_02 31:20

Yes, your soul knows, and you can read out the answers through the body, you just have to notice your conscious mind, just has to notice and pay attention, and then bring tools to it. So when I teach people tapping, it changes the game for them. Because I say in the past, when your conscious mind didn't know what to do, it would ignore or repress or try to talk your way out of a rationalize, which didn't really work. And I like what you said, I call it getting hit over the head with a two by four, yeah. Right? Like, wake up because no, this isn't working, this really isn't working. This is not working. So, um, so tune in. But once I teach the conscious mind tapping, I'm like, go tap on everything because um anything that is trauma related, and a lot of what people carry in their inner levels is trauma-related. Anything that's trauma related, tapping will clear. Now, there are other things that are not trauma-related that cause anxiety and pain in the inner levels. Um, but that's why I have a menu of 52 techniques.

SPEAKER_00 32:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 32:25

But mostly everybody comes in with trauma, and that's how they start, and then we start working on the dysfunctional family system patterns and the cultural brainwashing patterns and the self-destructive patterns and the addiction patterns and all of those kind of things. Um, but tapping works for, I would say, probably 60-70% of what people walk in with. Then the rest we we have other patterns and other techniques.

SPEAKER_01 32:52

So, what I'd love to do, Judith, now is just you've treated a lot of veterans, and I think there's some great insights uh for veterans, both both veterans who've experienced combat experiences and other sort of experiences like sexual assault and that kind of thing. So I'd love to before we got on the uh before I pushed record, you were talking about uh the veterans you had treated. Uh one, I wanted to start with the combat veterans, those veterans

Combat Trauma And Moral Injury Guilt

SPEAKER_01 33:27

who who had deployed, not necessarily who were infantry, artillery, but had deployed and had experienced some some combat trauma in some way. Talk about those cases and what your findings were and how you're able to help them.

SPEAKER_02 33:41

So, again, we're multi-level beings, right? We have a conscious mind, we have an unconscious mind, we have a body, and we have a soul. And bodies are very partial to self-preservation. In other words, that's why we have a fight or flight reflex. So, um, and and souls, you know, are here to live and experience life. So killing someone is counter to the value systems of your soul and your body, and probably even your unconscious mind, and probably your conscious mind too. So, what I found is that everybody who'd seen any kind of combat uh comes to my office and we're clearing combat trauma, and every single one of them muscle tested positive for I am a murderer. Now, there we have moral injury because it it was a negative belief. Murder was a bad thing, and it had to be treated because they were carrying this guilt about being a murderer. I tested other military veterans who had not seen combat and they did not have that that feeling. But I even tested a man who was an artillery gunner who never saw the face of the enemy. He was miles away shooting artillery into the forest, and he never knew in reality if he'd killed anybody or not, but nonetheless, the act of shooting artillery he coded I'm a murderer. So I had to treat that because it's an undercurrent of shame and guilt and a feeling of you know wrongness and badness about themselves because it's an identity structure, it starts with I am right, it's not I did or I perpetrated, it's I am. So it gets uh it gets woven into their identity, and I call those limiting identities not a good thing. But again, let's look at the alignment of the levels. They are doing it because whatever their reason is, they're in the military and they're doing it because they've been ordered to do it, and they have to follow orders, and so at whatever level of their being has agreed to follow orders, that's the behavior they're doing, but the other levels are disagreeing, but one level is dominating, and the other levels inside feel um in conflict. So now we have what I call misalignment of the levels because if all the levels agree that it was a good thing, they wouldn't be coming in and suffering from the pain of feeling that I'm a murderer. So some level at least didn't want to do it. So when we clear people of these misalignment, you know, of levels, we I do something called um an amend-making forgiveness practice. And it's amen-making forgiveness out of uh Judaism, the practice of teshuvah, which means sort of justice. So the teshuva process goes like this if you feel that you've done something wrong and you need to make amends, you you actually focus in on what you actually feel sorry about. You don't give a false apology just because somebody's mad at you, you actually go search your heart and you you figure out what you feel sorry about, and then you say I'm sorry, you say to the person you hurt, I say I'm sorry that I hurt you by doing X, and then you say, Please forgive me. And then you say, I'll never do it again. I'll never do it again. And then you wait for the other person to forgive you.

SPEAKER_01 38:00

Right.

SPEAKER_02 38:01

And they may or may not forgive you. But if they forgive you, then that's good, you're forgiven. And then you sweeten it by saying, and is there anything I can do to make it up to you?

unknown 38:16

Right.

SPEAKER_02 38:16

There you go. And if there is, it's usually something very reasonable. The person who is harmed forgives you, asks you for something reasonable, and you do it and you make amends. Now, where healing for the body level up comes in is a lot of times when people say, I promise I'll never do it again, nobody believes them because it wasn't their conscious intention to cause harm, and the conscious mind didn't have control over their behavior. That behavior was generated by a pattern running at the unconscious level or the body level or something, and their conscious mind can't apologize for the inner levels because they're still running.

SPEAKER_01 38:59

That is huge.

SPEAKER_02 39:01

So, what healing from the body level up does is I muscle test and ask, uh, are you still running the patterns that caused that behavior at the unconscious and body and soul levels? And if you are, then we heal those patterns so that they're not there anymore. And so they can genuinely, authentically, and congruently say, I'll never do it again. So I've had people uh who are perpetrators of violence, domestic violence, come to see me, both men and women, by the way, and they feel bad that they perpetrated violence. So I I muscle test and ask their souls the priority goal, clear all the violence patterns. And if their deepest wisdom says yes, that's the priority goal, I ask how many violence patterns do you have? We get a number, and then we literally work through and clear them so that they're not there anymore. Then I say go apologize.

SPEAKER_01 40:01

Yeah, that makes total sense because it's sort of like I think about it as a it used to be a software developer, and so you have these programs that are running on your desktop. You can see little icons and all this stuff. But if you hit control alt, um, and you see like all the different programs that are running on your computer at any one point, most of them are underneath the surface. You don't even know they're what they're doing. Your antivirus, your this, you're that, your different demons that not demons, but daemon programs that are just running in the background. You don't even know they're happening. And that's very much like the subconscious mind. It's just running. And unless you hit the control alt delete, where you can pull up the list and say, Oh, I I don't want that thing running, and end it, right? End the text like you do on your computer, it's still gonna run exactly your computer's running like crap, and you can't figure it out because I've closed all the programs. No, you've only closed the ones you can see, and so in total sense.

SPEAKER_02 41:08

So moral injury is a self-betrayal pattern because and and you need to do amend-making to yourself, right? Because what happened was you did a behavior that you object to, some level of you objects to, so in reality, you did that behavior, and some level of your being agreed to it, but the other levels of your being did not agree to it, and the levels that did not agree to it feel betrayed by the level that did agree to it and did the behavior. So I see this in date rape, and remember I had a um I had an Iraqi war vet woman um raped by her commanding officer. We had to treat that and it's sort of coded as a type of date rape. In other words, she told me that she liked being in the military, she liked her basic training because she knew for a fact that she could kill a man with her bare hands, and it made her feel safe and powerful walking around in this world. And I'm thinking to myself, if a woman who can kill somebody with their bare hands and makes it feel safe and powerful lets her commanding officer rape her, what happened there? So we had to do the amend making forgiveness, and her conscious mind agreed to it, even though her body didn't want to do it, obviously, and her unconscious mind didn't want to do it, and her soul didn't want to do it, but her conscious mind wanted to do it, and so she allowed it. So, what we had to do is we had to ask with compassion, we had to ask the conscious mind why it decided to do it, because it had its reasons, and we had to listen to its reasons and acknowledge its reasons, and so then the conscious mind said, These are my reasons for doing it. The inner levels go, Oh, okay, I understand, and then the conscious mind says, Please forgive me, and then the inner levels forgive you, and the internal conflict subsides. How about that?

SPEAKER_01 43:25

You know, it's so amazing because you um I'm thinking about how often this sort of thing plays out in mundane situations, like um we make a mistake at work, and and military people are famous about this because basic in basic training you get really uh scuffed up for every little mistake you make, right? Because it's trying to teach you attention to detail, but then we carry this into other things and the smallest mistakes, you know, misdoing

Amend Making And Self Forgiveness

SPEAKER_01 43:59

a report or breaking a piece of equipment. We absolutely destroy ourselves over it, and and it becomes very hard to like like recently I did something that broke a piece of equipment. I know it's gonna cost me money, and I just could not get past it. Like, I tried to tell myself it's okay, you just made a mistake, and blah blah blah. But now you're hearing this. I go, I need to do that, I need to revisit the thing and have that conversation you just had with myself and be able to. Say, hey, look, this is you know, and I'm not gonna do it. I learned my lesson, I'm not gonna do it again. I'm gonna make amends because I'm gonna pay this guy to fix it. But then, you know, let's be done with it kind of thing, instead of just stewing on it and stewing on it and stewing on it because I'm sitting there telling myself it's okay, man. You just but yet I couldn't get it off my mind. It's like, and what you're saying is like because there's levels in me that still aren't good with it or don't feel satisfied or whatever.

SPEAKER_02 45:07

Exactly. Right. So, yes, and you know, it's amazing how a sincere apology will really diffuse a situation.

SPEAKER_01 45:16

Certainly works with relations, you know, other people's relationships. If if there you know, if there's a genuine willingness on on everybody's part to want to have, to be you know, in harmony, then you'll accept the person's apologize, you'll apologize, whatever. You want to get past it as soon as you can, yeah. Um, and that's sort of like our we want to get past ourselves, right? We want to have nobody wants to live in pain, but right, you want to do it because we're integrated, right?

SPEAKER_02 45:54

Internally integrated, and all of you working together in the same direction as a team, yes, lovely. Uh now, honestly, I believe that's the challenge of life is to get your bubbles to align and all work together at the same time. So that's a continuous process, I'm here to say.

SPEAKER_01 46:12

Yeah, yeah. Well, I mean, that's what I really came from. Uh that that first day I read your book and I and I began to put it into practice. I literally came away from it going, I have a new purpose in life, and that's to integrate. Yes, integrate because when I do that, my personal mission will happen. Like I'll I'll have the resources I need to do my moral injury work, to help people find resources to be that husband I want to be, to to write that novel I want to write, whatever. Like it's the basis of everything, yeah. And from a Christian viewpoint, I see this as like you know, from my Christian standpoint, that Jesus did what he did so that I could be fully integrated, he cleared the way between my soul and God that I can be fully integrated and make that my purpose because that's why he did what he did in the first place, right? And you can and and so you know, yeah, it was just it's so freeing to say, Hey, I know that when I'm fully integrated, I make the world a better place, my world is better. The people in my relationship are gonna be, I'm gonna be better to them, like it really is the answer in my mind to everything, yeah. And that's the work too, right? It's yeah, it's a daily moment by moment thing, but it's fun.

SPEAKER_02 47:51

Yeah, definitely. It's a challenge. And when I when my clients come in, I teach them more than one technique, I teach them several techniques to deal with different patterns that run at different levels, and I teach them how to talk to their inner levels, I teach them how the inner levels work and how they think and what their value systems are. So, what I say is you're going to experience yourself as a multi-level being, and you are going to walk around on a day-to-day basis, uh, listening to your inner levels and functioning on multiple levels at the same time. And I say it's going to be very interesting, and you're going to get used to it because you have to get used to it. Because people remember, they're walking around thinking they're heads, right? But now they're walking around, they're getting feelings from the inside, they're getting sensations in their bodies, they're they're uh seeing the reality out there and noticing how they're interpreting things that maybe it's not proper to interpret it that way. So, for example, um, we have a cleaning lady, a new cleaning lady, and she's very thorough. I really appreciate that. And I couldn't find my

Listening To Your Body’s Signals

SPEAKER_02 49:09

hand lotion one day after she came. And I thought to myself, did she steal my hand lotion? Why would why would my cleaning lady steal a half bottle of my hand lotion?

SPEAKER_00 49:22

Right.

SPEAKER_02 49:22

Right. So, of course, I noticed that my first thought was she stole my hand lotion, but I observed that. I observed that was my first thought, and then I said, uh, I need to look around some more because it seems unlikely to me that she stole my hand lotion. So I got down on the shelf where it was supposed to be, and I looked to the back of the shelf because it was in the front of the shelf originally, and it was all the way in the back of the shelf. What I realized was she had literally taken everything off the shelf and dusted it and then put everything back not necessarily in the order that I had it organized. Right. And so so I so I was glad I looked again. But again, so I'm so I basically I hear my inner levels talk and I can't I converse with them. Right? I'm having this feeling I should listen to that. Does this need attention? And I muscle test does this need attention. For example, my toenail stopped growing about a year ago. My right knee is a big big toenail, and so I decided to talk to my toenail. So I muscle tested my toenail and asked it why it hadn't why it wasn't growing, and it said, because it had physical injury trauma from being jammed, and it said, and the blood flow to the nail was only 20%. So I said, All right, so I went back and did tapping on the physical injury trauma to my toenail, like for in the book, right? I I did a physical injury trauma on my toenail, and then it said that it raised the blood flow from 20% to 70%. And then I said, Can I increase the blood flow? I'm muscle testing the whole time. Can I increase the blood flow more than that? And it said, No. But I have a red light um wand, basically, you know, the red light for pain and healing stuff.

SPEAKER_00 51:23

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_02 51:24

And my my my toenails, so I have the red light over my toenail and I muscle tested, and I said, Will this help blood flow to the toenail? And said yes. So it said, do three minutes of red light um twice a day on the to on the to on the toenail bed, and that will increase the blood flow. So I said, All right, now you know toenails take a long time to grow, so I figured it would take a while. So it's been about a month, and this week I'm pretty sure the toenails started growing again because I can see it now. Yeah, but I mean, really, my toenail. So there's a lot of things you have to juggle when you live in a body. Yeah, yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 52:04

I I would have thought, you know, like three weeks ago, I would have heard that story and thought that is weird, but not anymore because that that first night, uh, I'll give you since you gave an example, uh, when I first started talking and listening to myself, my arm immediately started tingling, right? And about three months ago, I had surgery where they had to reattach the tendon to my to my bone because it snapped off and stuff. And so I did physical therapy, you know, and it was in a really good place, but it had gotten to where the nerves are still trying to grow back, right? So it had gotten to where it would be itching and it would be doing things, and I was just trying to ignore it. So, so that first night when I started talking to myself, my arm immediately began to tingle, and I said, Okay, what are you feeling? What's happening? You know, in a very gentle voice, and it said, You abandoned me. I said, What do you mean? It said, You stopped doing physical therapy and then you abandoned me, and you've been ignoring me. And you know, and so I said, Okay, I'm gonna I'm gonna stop doing that. I'm gonna start because the therapist said, Massage it every night, that helps get the nerve endings, helps keep. I said, I'm gonna start doing that, and it said, Okay, immediately it calmed down. The tingling stopped because it I had made it a promise, yeah, and and then my foot was started tingling. I was like, Okay, what's happening with you? And it said it, and I muscle tested, is this just athlete's foot? And it said, Yes, but I still wanted to be taken care of, and and my feet said, Um, you know, I've taken care of you all these years, I've never given you any trouble, and you just ignore me, and you don't even treat me like I matter, and all that instantly rung true because I knew that was right, you know. I I you know, and so I said, I'm gonna start taking care of that, and it calmed down. I mean, so I can say uh like that very first night I started putting these things into practice, right? Immediate results, and and the challenge now is to not go, well, I'm good, and and get back into old habits of ignoring things, but your body will definitely speak to you uh in a way that you can I will know it's true, and the muscle testing helps. What I love about again about the book, we're kind of wrapping up here. Um, but two things I love about it. One, this is based you're you you started the show talk about how much of a scientist you were. People like me need to hear that. When I've when I've had other people that try to get me into quote unquote woo-woo stuff, they weren't like science type people, they they were they were more like um that just didn't ring for them, right? And so so I'd be like, eh. But when you

Reproducible Protocols And Mass Healing

SPEAKER_01 55:07

say, okay, you're a science scientist, and and you've used like legitimate scientific methods to test your protocols, yes, and then you have all these clients that you've used these protocols work and they work, that's really good for someone like me who's a little skeptical. I can just say, okay, this is real science. I was talking to a friend of mine uh last week who's a family doctor, retired military family doctor. She surprised me a little bit with her response, but I was telling her about what I was doing, and she's like, Yeah, totally, it's common sense, it's science. This is not woo-woo stuff. This is yeah, this is like your body, physiology. Yeah, so I love that. The other part that I love is that this is stuff anybody can do. I have read your book, it was immediately uh accessible, like the things and the protocols and the techniques were immediately accessible, usable, understandable. And so this is this is not like a heavy academic, like you know, type. This is a book where the any person can read it, begin to practice it, understand it, and see some results. Yeah. Um and I love that that it's accessible that way.

SPEAKER_02 56:29

Yeah, I base everything on results. This book is 40 years of my research in one book. Yeah. And it's reproducible. That's the whole point. The reason that I got into mind-body healing, you know, as a scientist, was because I wanted to use the scientific method to make it reproducible. So everything is a protocol. Once I figure it out and I test it on multiple people and I get the results back and I measure results, it becomes a protocol, a written protocol, step one, step two, step three. So yeah, read the book. You'll understand the mechanisms, follow the protocols, and treat as much trauma as you can. Now, there are other types of trauma that need to, you need to use a professional. For example, the PTSD, it's sort of a multi-layered structure. So that you need to do somebody do with somebody who's trained to do that particular structure. And of course, if you have religious and multiple, you know, cultural brainwashing patterns and that type of thing, uh, and and ego structure patterns, because there's some ego structure stuff that needs to be done, you need to do that with a professional. But really, most everybody comes in with trauma.

SPEAKER_00 57:41

Right.

SPEAKER_02 57:42

And I I started a uh a mass trauma healing webinar because I thought, you know, we should just do mass trauma healing. And it's already had a couple sessions at Fantastic. So I I scheduled it again, where uh, you know, once a week we have an evening, an hour and a half, and I say who has a trauma they want to work on. And of course, the person who has the trauma, half the people have the same trauma.

SPEAKER_00 58:07

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_02 58:08

The first session we did diagnosis shock about uh some kind of illness and how that interfered with you uh treating the trauma treating the illness. The this this last week we did pet pet death. And yeah, half the people lost pets and still had trauma from next week. We're gonna do um we're going to do adoption and abandonment.

SPEAKER_01 58:32

Oh, huge. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 58:33

Yeah. I mean it goes on and on. And on my website, I did a mass healing of uh trauma from Hurricane Ellen, natural disaster trauma.

SPEAKER_00 58:46

Right.

SPEAKER_02 58:47

And we had several hundred people on the call who, right when it was happening, I mean we got it within a week, and people were not were not sleeping, and they, you know, trees had fallen down and their friends were drowning, sick like horrible. And so we did a mass healing, and people were emailing me, oh, thank you. I can sleep, I can breathe for the first time, you know, in days, and so on and so forth. So, really learn about your bodies, learn a technique that your conscious mind can use to actually treat things that are bothering you on the inside. So you don't have to ignore it, you don't have to stuff it down, you don't have to yell at yourself anymore. Just learn conscious minds, learn how to treat your inner levels. Yes, that's your job.

SPEAKER_01 59:30

Um, so it's as we finish here today. First of all, thanks so much. You've been a great guest. I uh and you're helping so many people, and I hope everybody that hears this gets the book. So tell us again what the name of the book is, as well as your website and how they get in touch with you if they want a deeper uh treatment or or help from you.

SPEAKER_02 59:52

Yeah, the book is called Clear Trauma Now. Just remember Clear Trauma Now, and um it's on Amazon by Judith A. Swack,

Book Resources And Closing

SPEAKER_02 1:00:04

PhD. And uh you can go to my website, hblu.org, short for healing from the body levelup.org. Hblu.org. You can get a 15-minute free consult with me, see if I can help you privately. Um, you can read the book, you can sign up for the mass trauma healing webinar. Yes, ooh, let's just detraumatize the world. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:29

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:30

And um, and definitely read the book, share it with people, really. Let's get it out there. Nobody should walk around suffering from trauma when it takes just hours, not years, but hours to clear trauma. You shouldn't carry it around in your body, it's bad for you.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:46

Yeah, um, a friend of mine is really fond of saying hurt people, hurt people, and I love that. If the more we clear our own hurts, the less likely we are to hurt other people. And if everybody I'm convinced, if everybody in the planet was walking around integrated, there'd be no need for war, militaries, police, all that we would just take care of each other, and because that's what our soul wants to do is be in harmony with other people, and all this conflict and stuff we have in the world, and pain and suffering, and illness, and all that is more or less a lack of integration um on individual and mass scales, you know. So, anyway, it's been great talking to you, and uh um again, I I'm really excited about this. It's been great talking to somebody who is who has changed my life in a significant way, and uh, I appreciate it.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:46

So um I you're so welcome, and it does my heart good to know that it's getting out there, I'm making a difference. Yes, everybody learn how to clear trauma, it's it's easy.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:01

Yeah, and and your your life and everybody will thank you for it. So okay, Judith. Uh it's been great, and uh uh we'll talk again sometime.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:14

Thank you, Daniel. This is sacred work.